Shab-e-Miraj and Shab-e-Baraat..It's not right.

[usama321]

who does the community get guidance frm,the imams or religious and learned scholars,right?.so how u can say that,as i said there r reservations among the many imams abt this,there have been debates but what u dont get is the intention behind it,if u say the majority of community is wrong then u negate the hadith i quoted abv and also this"avoid the branching path and stick to the general community".Now dont say that the community and the scholars in that can be wrong. Cant our duas be granted special status in this night like in Al qadr night.Imam shafi did say tht extra prayers are perfectly acceptable if though exclusively on this night well ofcourse i do agree that u have to be consistent ,i mean that is the essence like its a promise for later on and giving exclusive preference to this over other Farz prayers on this day or night for tht matter is however a biddah or disobedience to be more precise.If u say like this then the friday prayer is a biddah in accordance with what u say,do correct me if m wrong, coz u do see masses of people giving exclusive preference to this prayer rather than others too though the friday prayer has been given unique importance in the quran but what about the others,so as per ur last statement ,it is rather a very wrong trend and a bidat as u may see(last line).Do correct me if u see something wrong.
btw we r cool,right?

you need to get your facts straight brother....... There are a thousand ahadith and verses about the fazilat of friday prayer... Are you kidding me by giving it as an example of biddah? You just don't give ANY night a special status without AUTHENTIC proof, ok? now laila tul qadr has more than enough authentic proof about its existence.....On the other hand there is NO authentic proof for this.

Allah says that he descends on the first heavens every night in the 3/4th part of it.....Now, of course the prayers at that time have special status. But if i start saying that my taqdir is being decided today, when there is no proof for this, well that is biddah. And disobedience is a sperate thing....pls refer to google if you don't know what biddah is

 

[usama321]

u just contradicted urself,..regarding the former,well, i quoted tht hadith abt the community right,u cant just say that on ur own,as i have said its a very debatable and has been an always debatable topic.so according to my thinking,i dont completely deny this night though some of the many innovations r however wrong,U want a Ahadith,well,if it were to be tht simple coz u simply say tht u want a sound Ahadith,it wud have been rejected quite a milenium ago.it aint that simple,got that....just think how did this root enuf to be observed by the majority within the presence of the learned ,not now but ages before as well.some things in it may be wrong but the major belief is frm wht i think stands correct.(As always,do correct me if m wrong(thru valid reason this time))
btw ,we r cool bro,right?

pray tell me how did i contradict myself?

If you can't give me a hadis, then you are saying that you are following something just because your ancestors did.....Refer to the quran and how many times it tells that we should not blindly follow our ancestors, and gives us examples of Bani Israel.........Majority does not mean something is correct.....One hadis says that Muslims will be divided into 73 sects before qiyamat.......and only one sect will go into heaven.........this renders your majority argument baseless

 

[usama321]

Well, i've had enough of this debate. I am not a religious scholar, and all i was trying to do was to back my argument with religious proof. Research for yourself if you want to, because i can't force anything onto you or anyone else.

 

[knowitall10]

who does the community get guidance frm,the imams or religious and learned scholars,right?.so how u can say that,as i said there r reservations among the many imams abt this,there have been debates but what u dont get is the intention behind it,if u say the majority of community is wrong then u negate the hadith i quoted abv and also this"avoid the branching path and stick to the general community".Now dont say that the community and the scholars in that can be wrong. Cant our duas be granted special status in this night like in Al qadr night.Imam shafi did say tht extra prayers are perfectly acceptable if though exclusively on this night well ofcourse i do agree that u have to be consistent ,i mean that is the essence like its a promise for later on and giving exclusive preference to this over other Farz prayers on this day or night for tht matter is however a biddah or disobedience to be more precise.If u say like this then the friday prayer is a biddah in accordance with what u say,do correct me if m wrong, coz u do see masses of people giving exclusive preference to this prayer rather than others too though the friday prayer has been given unique importance in the quran but what about the others,so as per ur last statement ,it is rather a very wrong trend and a bidat as u may see(last line).Do correct me if u see something wrong.
btw we r cool,right?

the friday prayer is mentioned in the Qur'an...give me a reference that will convince me that 15th Sha'ban is the night in which Allah re-writes the Qadar please...any one reference which is authentic.

 

[knowitall10]

Exactly. My job was to inform my Muslim brothers and sisters, now it's upon you if you want to listen or follow your ways...Allah Knws Best...and because you think differently than i do, i would call this a doubt and leave it. in any case, we shouldn't be celebrating it
May Allah guide us all to whats right and may we refrain from everything that's wrong...

 

[M.Omar]

you need to get your facts straight brother....... There are a thousand ahadith and verses about the fazilat of friday prayer... Are you kidding me by giving it as an example of biddah? You just don't give ANY night a special status without AUTHENTIC proof, ok? now laila tul qadr has more than enough authentic proof about its existence.....On the other hand there is NO authentic proof for this.

Allah says that he descends on the first heavens every night in the 3/4th part of it.....Now, of course the prayers at that time have special status. But if i start saying that my taqdir is being decided today, when there is no proof for this, well that is biddah. And disobedience is a sperate thing....pls refer to google if you don't know what biddah is

biddah is innovation right?,anything away frm religion,made up and consequently given more imp..is tht right?
yup,u r right on this one,tht friday one,irrelevant.....abt tht blindly ancestors,thts wht i was hoping u wudn,t say.why did i include the words LEARNED scholars.......u get the rest right.Do clarify the hadith abt the qiyamat.Abt that taqdeer ,cant duas be given special status in this night ,ofcourse not to alter our entire taqdeer coz tht wud be u know pointless.but what about exalted status of our worships...Well,i aint demanding u to convince me but m just putting some arguments wht i think r valid....
we r cool now,nothing against u of course(at least say something abt this one)

 

[knowitall10]

biddah is innovation right?,anything away frm religion,made up and consequently given more imp..is tht right?
yup,u r right on this one,tht friday one,irrelevant.....abt tht blindly ancestors,thts wht i was hoping u wudn,t say.why did i include the words LEARNED scholars.......u get the rest right.Do clarify the hadith abt the qiyamat.Abt that taqdeer ,cant duas be given special status in this night ,ofcourse not to alter our entire taqdeer coz tht wud be u know pointless.but what about exalted status of our worships...Well,i aint demanding u to convince me but m just putting some arguments wht i think r valid....
we r cool now,nothing against u of course(at least say something abt this one)

Which learned scholars are you referring to, brother?

 

[M.Omar]

Exactly. My job was to inform my Muslim brothers and sisters, now it's upon you if you want to listen or follow your ways...Allah Knws Best...and because you think differently than i do, i would call this a doubt and leave it. in any case, we shouldn't be celebrating it
May Allah guide us all to whats right and may we refrain from everything that's wrong...

Ameen ,yar bilkul.

 

[usama321]

biddah is innovation right?,anything away frm religion,made up and consequently given more imp..is tht right?
yup,u r right on this one,tht friday one,irrelevant.....abt tht blindly ancestors,thts wht i was hoping u wudn,t say.why did i include the words LEARNED scholars.......u get the rest right.Do clarify the hadith abt the qiyamat.Abt that taqdeer ,cant duas be given special status in this night ,ofcourse not to alter our entire taqdeer coz tht wud be u know pointless.but what about exalted status of our worships...Well,i aint demanding u to convince me but m just putting some arguments wht i think r valid....
we r cool now,nothing against u of course(at least say something abt this one)

of course we are cool only thing is pls tell me the name of these learned scholars, cuz even scholars can be wrong........And i am not saying it on my authority, i am talking about shab e barat on authority of Imam Bukhari....If you want a recent name, there is dr. Israr ahmad too

 

[M.Omar]

Which learned scholars are you referring to, brother?

i mean nowadays and before,this celebration is quite social and they wud issue thoughtful directives regarding this

 

[M.Omar]

m gonna give u a site i referred to first,but gonna go right now, so later?
btw dont thinking i m just bailing

 

[knowitall10]

i mean nowadays and before,this celebration is quite social and they wud issue thoughtful directives regarding this

I know it's been celebrated in India Pak Bangladesh Burma..but if it were a celebration, then they would have celebrated in Al-Haram now woudn't they? And the laws of Haram Sharif are according to the laws of the Grand Mufti here in Saudi Arabia...

 

[M.Omar]

am quite convinced actually,but if facts are quite simple(comparatively)just dont know why is this concept so misunderstood e.t.c and e.t.c..Guess its time to put a zipper on this thread...end of discussion i guess.

 

[knowitall10]

am quite convinced actually,but if facts are quite simple(comparatively)just dont know why is this concept so misunderstood e.t.c and e.t.c..Guess its time to put a zipper on this thread...end of discussion i guess.

yeah..but let's not end it here now...
many people might want to clear their misconceptions...but if u mean we stop discussing whatever we were right now..fine

 

[M.Omar]

yeah..but let's not end it here now...
many people might want to clear their misconceptions...but if u mean we stop discussing whatever we were right now..fine

the latter part.

 

[M.Omar]

of course we are cool only thing is pls tell me the name of these learned scholars, cuz even scholars can be wrong........And i am not saying it on my authority, i am talking about shab e barat on authority of Imam Bukhari....If you want a recent name, there is dr. Israr ahmad too

this is the site,as i told u,everything ain,t that simple in to just quoting up the obvious,do read the full extract,the first part till the end,the first part does supplement urs but it does quote an authentic hadith frm ibn majaahs book,(tht guy wont be lying abt the hadith at least).do read,i know tht urdu may be diff to understandhttp://www.urduplanet.com/showthread.php?t=5464

 

[usama321]

this is the site,as i told u,everything ain,t that simple in to just quoting up the obvious,do read the full extract,the first part till the end,the first part does supplement urs but it does quote an authentic hadith frm ibn majaahs book,(tht guy wont be lying abt the hadith at least).do read,i know tht urdu may be diff to understandhttp://www.urduplanet.com/showthread.php?t=5464

yar i told you i am not debating on this anymore........though what the is saying as biddah..........don't you see any difference in Hazrat Umer and yourself when you say tarawih is biddah?

about that Airab wala part, nothing NEW was introduced in the quran, in the religion.........you can't classify that as biddah?

and yar aap ko hazar dafa kaha hai ke its no sin to just pray on that night....lekin jab intention specifically ye ho ke ye khas raat hai, phir Allah hadayat de, cuz it is something new in the religion

Lastly, bhai mai Imam Bukhari se relate ker raha hun, and i think he is the best authority on this.

Peace.

 

[Toblerone]

yar i told you i am not debating on this anymore........though what the is saying as biddah..........don't you see any difference in Hazrat Umer and yourself when you say tarawih is biddah?

about that Airab wala part, nothing NEW was introduced in the quran, in the religion.........you can't classify that as biddah?

and yar aap ko hazar dafa kaha hai ke its no sin to just pray on that night....lekin jab intention specifically ye ho ke ye khas raat hai, phir Allah hadayat de, cuz it is something new in the religion

Lastly, bhai mai Imam Bukhari se relate ker raha hun, and i think he is the best authority on this.

Peace.

Ena tu scholar.

 

[usama321]

Ena tu scholar.

Stalker -___-

kabi banda kisi ache topic pe bat ker le to beech mai bache nai bolte hote........

 

[Toblerone]

Stalker -___-

kabi banda kisi ache topic pe bat ker le to beech mai bache nai bolte hote........

*le me be a batameez bacha
Uncle aap zyada molvi na banain,aapki asliyat sab kai samnay lai aaoon gi.
Mind it.